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Dark Souls
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Synonamess Botch
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July 27, 2014 - 11:27 am
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DS is the first melee-based combat game I've ever played...

Well you've certainly started with the best, in my humble opinion.  Unfortunately, Dark Souls 2 takes a HUGE step backwards in this regard. cry

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Helmut
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July 28, 2014 - 12:46 pm
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Dang, you Brits have a lot under the skirts. We'll have to establish that the Tap tunnels are 'Important for Britain's Economic Interests'  (24 minute mark) at which point we'll get our own Security Liason Officer, and I expect that individual will make mad martinis. 

My Dark Souls single player sensibilities are protected by a +10 GfWL Firewall of Ineptitude

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Synonamess Botch
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July 29, 2014 - 10:44 pm
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I fired up the game during the weekend and could not get any online interaction of any sort.  I saw messages, bloodstains, phantoms, even miracle synergy points, but no coop or PvP.  Not once.

Rule #2: Double-tap

simplen00b
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July 30, 2014 - 9:34 am
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I've had a few sessions where I've put a summons down, waited 30 minutes or more and got nothing. Then I try again a few hours later and get 4-5 summons in a row, sometimes more. (I've got three builds - level 18 for bell gargs/Capra, level 50 for Anor Londo, level 89 for Dukes - although I've got a new build simmering away too.) 

Got several rounds in with the bell gargoyles yesterday, and had one invader who I almost felt sorry for. My host and I were in front of the fog door waiting for Solaire's summon to finish - just as Solaire emerged, an invader started materialising right in the middle of us.

I'm afraid none of us (including Solaire) showed any mercy. Poor guy didn't even get the chance to lift his/her weapon.

miracle synergy points

And finally I learn what those floating white rings are. Looks like they could be useful for my new cleric build...up_to_something

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Synonamess Botch
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July 30, 2014 - 12:47 pm
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an invader started materialising right in the middle of us.

Where's the "evil laugh" emoticon?  Yep - you invade in the Parish, you takes your chances.

Looks like they could be useful for my new cleric build

Unfortunately this was one of those features which probably looked good on paper.  It can be useful, but is too random to rely on.  Nonetheless, clerics are great fun.  Just don't expect to get to the better miracles for a while.  Protip: Find that optional boss in Anor Londo and either fight him or join him (or both).  Protip2: Sunbros for life!

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Helmut
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July 30, 2014 - 4:28 pm
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I'm finding lots of summons signs early on in the burg, a bit at Quelaag's area, then again in Anor Londo at the camp past the two a**es, but past that, nothing. 

My Dark Souls single player sensibilities are protected by a +10 GfWL Firewall of Ineptitude

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Steerpike
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July 31, 2014 - 1:48 am
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I loved those white rings, and the Gravelord messages. They were so mysterious. It was like the bells ringing in the Parish - every time you hear a bell it means someone else just rung it. Like the ghosts of other players, those things helped make the game for me. You're alone but never alone, never quite alone. You have no clue what some of the stuff means - I'd finished Dark Souls before I found out about the white rings - but it's there. Xtal would like to see a narrower, tighter focus in Dark Souls 3, which I can get behind provided they don't go too far (the hugeness and terror of the unfamiliar world was also a major thing for me). What I'd add to the mix is more of the distant interactions, more of the we're in this together... but not really.

Could even work with my theory about space in Dark Souls 2, which I'm prepping an article on. Solaire says right off that reality is breaking down, other worlds and timelines crisscrossing at random. Dark Souls is very much about the end of the world, and I don't agree with the reviewers who've said DkS2 trivializes that. The walls of reality are coming down; for players it'd be a really cool good thing in the fiction of the bad.

Life is the misery we endure between disappointments.

simplen00b
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July 31, 2014 - 8:22 am
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Got two summons to fight O&S last night and won both of them. The first one was one of the easiest O&S bouts I've had - the host had a sword that could stagger super Smough so he hardly ever got to do his electric botty stom, plus Solaire survived pretty much to the end, which made things a lot more straightforward. The second fight was - much tighterlara

Still not sure of the best approach to O&S as a summons tbh - sometimes I see who the host goes for first and target that one, but sometimes (especially when it's just me and the host) I've left him fighting one while I keep the other one engaged/away from him. If you were a host and definitely wanted one of them dead first, how would you communicate it?

don't expect to get to the better miracles for a while

Yeah, I'm taking the tried and tested claymore route so far, and trying to remember to use the heal miracle instead of estus when I need it (and things aren't kicking off). My hugely grandiose plan is to eventually get some of the magic-stopping miracles (Word of Silence?) so when I get summoned against hugely-magicked up twinkers I can slam that door in their face and then pummel them to death with my tiny undead fists. Yes!

Sunbros for life!

My level 19 build has joined the Sun Bro covenant and...no summons since I've done so. I know the first time I saw the golden summons sign I had no idea what it meant and didn't choose it, plus last night I was watching a walkthrough where the player saw a golden summons sign and thought it might mean inviting an invader in. So not sure it was the right move at the mo, but maybe I'm jumping to conclusions. 

 

the hugeness and terror of the unfamiliar world was also a major thing for me

Oh
yes

I've read that the world design for DS2 is more mysterious/ethereal as opposed to the grim/oppressive design for DS1. Is that true? If it is, I quite like the sound of it. I love the immensity of the design in DS but sometimes the feeling of having everything bearing down on you gets a Bit Much.

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Synonamess Botch
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July 31, 2014 - 11:01 am
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I typically watch who the host attacks, then go for the other.  But not for attacking, just distracting.  If it's just me and the host, and it appears he's having trouble on his own, I'll change up my strategy.

Actually, there is a way to get good miracles very early on.  But you have to get to the Tomb of Giants.  However, you don't have to defeat the boss, but if you don't have the Lordvessel you'll have to hump it out of there the long way.  It's very do-able, and pretty exciting for a low-level character.

Golden summon sign is indeed for summoning sunbros for jolly coop.

Rule #2: Double-tap

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Steerpike
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July 31, 2014 - 11:21 am
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I'm writing an article about the world design of Dark Souls 2 that may answer your question, Simple. Overall "ethereal" is a good word for it. It has a completely, immediately different emotional vibe from the moment the starting movie wraps up, and particularly when you get to the Dark Souls 2 equivalent of Firelink Shrine.

Having googled a theory about why my PC version defies me, I'm going to try and get it fixed tonight. The lack of a really strong co-op community on PC always hurt the game. Throw a summon sign down in the Anor Londo Castle bonfire room on the PS3 and you'll be summoned within five minutes. PC, meanwhile, sometimes I couldn't put down a summon sign because the invasions were coming in (and failing to connect due to GFWL) so regularly.

Life is the misery we endure between disappointments.

simplen00b
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July 31, 2014 - 5:10 pm
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you have to get to the Tomb of Giants...It's very do-able, and pretty exciting for a low-level character. 

So far I haven't been to ToG at all. I'll probably make a visit with my level 89 tank so I can get some idea of the way round before I send Poor Little Level 19 Build down there. Although PLL19B can now wear most of the Black Iron set on mid-roll so I'm wondering whether she'd survive an NLR run for the very large ember. Getting my claymore up to +15 would be sweet. Terrifying to achieve, but sweet. Seeing how far I can get in the game on the lowest possible level is - interesting. Terrifyng, but interesting.

@Steerpike - looking forward to the article. I'm going to try and limit myself to reading about DS2 rather than gorging on videos like I did/am doing for DS1; try to keep it a bit more of a fresh experience when I eventually come to play it (sometime in 2017).

Re PC on-line play - since I've got into putting my summons sign down, I'd say I get good co-op sessions about 70% of the time, with the first summons arriving in about 5 minutes. On which note: my concerns that joining SunBro covenant may have been a bad idea have been thoroughly laid to rest. PLL19B had five good bouts earlier this evening before I sent her down to the depths of The Depths where she vanquished Gaping D first time round (eventually). Well done her! (I still don't find that fight easy.)

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Helmut
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July 31, 2014 - 5:41 pm
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I spent most of the first two play-throughs hiding in the dark in the Tomb. I hated finding the fires, and avoided all possible skeletons, and found those skele-beasts to be very difficult. Not so with my 45 int crystal soulmass and homing soulmass spells providing seeking one hit kills. I've finally explored the area, which I've always found incredibly confusing. Not so good is the Nito boss battle, where I now lack sufficient damage on my divine weapon to deal quickly with the little skeletons, magic damage only temporarily slowing them. 

My Dark Souls single player sensibilities are protected by a +10 GfWL Firewall of Ineptitude

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Synonamess Botch
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July 31, 2014 - 6:35 pm
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Making low-level runs for high-level gear is one of the funnest parts of the game.  The beloved Very Large Ember is one of the most obvious ones.  To get it really early you have to commit murder though. cry

Helmut, you can get away with just avoiding those skeletons, especially with your 45 Int powered sorceries.  Just make sure you don't attract the attention of the big ones.  Nito's AoE attack thingy conveniently kills them.

All this talk of ToG runs is giving me the Dark Souls itch again...

Rule #2: Double-tap

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Helmut
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July 31, 2014 - 11:04 pm
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Botch, I've read that, but somehow it's not working for me, in any build. I think the problem starts with always getting attacked by Nito's large blade from the ground, despite having read that that attack is geared to the cast light spell, and is random if you don't have that active. I don't want to approach Nito right when I drop in, in order to avoid the large skeletons in the back, but I can't seem to last long enough to wait for him to come to my end. Last play through, I had a powerful divine weapon, and gads of dex so with 6 swipes the little guys were all toast, and I could take the time to swap to the katana, and jump roll enough to avoid the blades until I could safely get close to Nito, at which point he was done. I wonder if this is a pc thing, or maybe I've got something wrong? 

My Dark Souls single player sensibilities are protected by a +10 GfWL Firewall of Ineptitude

simplen00b
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August 1, 2014 - 10:30 am
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To get it really early you have to commit murder though.

??? - Is that 

 If so, how does that speed up getting the ember? *confused face* 

My Poor Little Level 19 Build is now a muscular (faith-wise) strapping Level 30 build that can wield lightning spears. She was to-ing and fro-ing in Anor Londo last night for about 45 minutes in human form and had no invasions. Not one. O&S are still alive and kicking, so either there was no-one around in the level 30 range, or no-one around full stop. No summons signs either apart from dear old Solaire (bless). I want to try and top out her Black Iron armour upgrades (but I'm also going for Quelaag's Furysword and the Dragon Bone Fist), so I really need some jolly co-op to get some serious souls input. I guess Quelaag and Gaping D are the best bets at this level.

Mmmm...maybe I should beat O&S first so I can start warping to the Depths and Blight Town. Walking to those bonfires can be a bit tiresome.

*studies wiki, charts, maps and tables; applies differential calculus to work out best plan of action*

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Steerpike
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August 1, 2014 - 11:40 am
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Studying charts and maps, then applying differential calculus, is another of the funnest parts of the game!

My good news for the day: finally got Dark Souls up and running again - Windows 8 just needed GFWL reinstalled. Technically I played a sorcerer the very first time around, but I almost never sorcered after the Burg. Having seen the power of Homing Soulmass and the like, I'm going to give that a run.

My spunky redheaded pyromancer is level 51 or so and still patiently waiting to defeat O&S, so the only nice thing about GFWL is that it saved her profile. That's good news in case anyone wants to co-op. My GFWL name is, I think, Klordane. It's a long story.

Life is the misery we endure between disappointments.

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Synonamess Botch
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August 1, 2014 - 9:02 pm
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Simple, yes that particular murder victim.

You can't get the Very Large Ember until you drain New Londo.  Ingward won't give you the key to the Seal unless you have the Lordvessel, but his corpse will.

Level 30 may be a tad low for Anor Londo.  The thing about invasions is that, at least in terms of level, they favor the invaded.  So you can't invade those (much) lower level than you.  But ANY level higher than you is available.

Hmm, am I overusing the "funnest parts of the game" phrase perhaps?  Guilty.  You got it working, yea!  I need to work up a mid-level-ish character.  All of mine on PC are over 80 or under 12.  What a great excuse to start a new one!

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Helmut
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August 2, 2014 - 12:01 am
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My sorcerer is level 66. I am struck by how much easier the sorcerer is than the dex build as long as I don't need melee protection. With my dex builld, I was farming the painted world until I was needing 27000 souls/level. This time through, I think I left the area when I was needing 18,000 souls/level. Again I think it's because you don't have to do much point splitting when the pyromancer levels can be simply bought and dex/str/endurance aren't as much of an issue. Steerpike if you can reach level 56 give or take one, I think I ought to be able to join you if you should want a bumbling spell casting walker who can't lock. 

My Dark Souls single player sensibilities are protected by a +10 GfWL Firewall of Ineptitude

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Steerpike
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August 2, 2014 - 12:33 pm
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56 should be attainable. I'm prowling the palace so I have access to the Painted World, Lautrec's hidin' spot, and lots of Silver Knights. In terms of gathering sweet, sweet souls, you can't beat the Anor Londo neighborhood. Stay tuned!

@Botch: no! You are not overusing funnest part of the game. I wasn't teasing, I loved looking at the wikis and charts, especially since I'd do it from the office (where I couldn't play, obv). It had the dual benefit of creating a sense of anticipation - "when I get home, I'm gonna feed the cat, then I'm etc etc etc." - and giving me something to do for the rest of the day. It's not like I'm going to work unless they make me. I mean come on.

Life is the misery we endure between disappointments.

simplen00b
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August 2, 2014 - 2:33 pm
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@Botch: Gotcha. Hadn't registered the part that the Lordvessel played. All Is Now Clear.

@Steerpike: My level 50 tankette is parked on the boss steps ready and willing to wave a claymore around in a panic-stricken fashion on your behalf (GfWL monicker: SnifflyFire03). Today - Ornstein & Smough; tomorrow - Ornstein & Smough!! The day after that - Ornstein and Smough (again)!!!! Tuesday evening - Ornstetcetc

Actually, while typing this I got summoned and have just had probably the most epic O&S fight I've had. Just me and the host - I danced around a pillar keeping Ornstein occupied until the host downed Smough; then we had an absolute battle royale against SO. We both kept coming at him from opposite directions, running in from behind to take shards off his health then rolling away again. Eventually we got him down to about 3% health, but mine wasn't much better - I had used up my available humanity, and I think my host had ran out of estus - but just as I thought we might have it -

SO killed me.

And in my final dying moments in the host's world, I saw SO dissolve into a blizzard of silver snow.

Very, very, very sweet. (My first ever victory against SO too, I think.)

UPDATE: And I've had another two summons, both ending up against SO - won one, lost one (or died before SO did anyway). The second victory was with a host who first got invaded by a Spirit of Vengeance (whom we vanquished). Troubling question - does that mean my host have have been a not-very-nice person? 

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