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	<title>Comments on: Room With A Grue</title>
	<atom:link href="http://tap-repeatedly.com/2009/06/02/room-with-a-grue/feed/" rel="self" type="application/rss+xml" />
	<link>http://tap-repeatedly.com/2009/06/02/room-with-a-grue/</link>
	<description>Games. Media. Opinions. Attitude.</description>
	<lastBuildDate>Fri, 10 Sep 2010 18:21:20 +0000</lastBuildDate>
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		<title>By: Mike "Scout" Gust</title>
		<link>http://tap-repeatedly.com/2009/06/02/room-with-a-grue/#comment-6381</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike "Scout" Gust</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 21 Jul 2010 02:38:08 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tap-repeatedly.com/?p=3075#comment-6381</guid>
		<description>Thanks Armand. Keep me posted. 
When I wrote this I was thinking there would be a part two. If I was smart I would talk about how architecture defines sex. But I&#039;m usually dumb. Stay tuned regardless.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Thanks Armand. Keep me posted.<br />
When I wrote this I was thinking there would be a part two. If I was smart I would talk about how architecture defines sex. But I&#8217;m usually dumb. Stay tuned regardless.</p>
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		<title>By: Armand</title>
		<link>http://tap-repeatedly.com/2009/06/02/room-with-a-grue/#comment-6372</link>
		<dc:creator>Armand</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Tue, 20 Jul 2010 20:19:01 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tap-repeatedly.com/?p=3075#comment-6372</guid>
		<description>Just wanted to let you know I completely enjoyed the article. I&#039;m forwarding this page to some non-gamer friends.. let&#039;s see if they&#039;ll read it.  : )</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Just wanted to let you know I completely enjoyed the article. I&#8217;m forwarding this page to some non-gamer friends.. let&#8217;s see if they&#8217;ll read it.  : )</p>
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		<title>By: Gregg B</title>
		<link>http://tap-repeatedly.com/2009/06/02/room-with-a-grue/#comment-4802</link>
		<dc:creator>Gregg B</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jun 2010 11:39:19 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tap-repeatedly.com/?p=3075#comment-4802</guid>
		<description>I really ought to link to this piece in my Suspension of Disbelief article because it summarises perfectly why simply moving through a virtual space is every bit as captivating as doing things in it. As I semi-skimmed down to your comment I remembered the Milkman Conspiracy level (semi-skimmed geddit?) in Psychonauts which is one of the finest level designs I&#039;ve ever come across structurally and conceptually. If you haven&#039;t played it, then I highly recommend you check it out, it&#039;s superb.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I really ought to link to this piece in my Suspension of Disbelief article because it summarises perfectly why simply moving through a virtual space is every bit as captivating as doing things in it. As I semi-skimmed down to your comment I remembered the Milkman Conspiracy level (semi-skimmed geddit?) in Psychonauts which is one of the finest level designs I&#8217;ve ever come across structurally and conceptually. If you haven&#8217;t played it, then I highly recommend you check it out, it&#8217;s superb.</p>
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		<title>By: Mike "Scout" Gust</title>
		<link>http://tap-repeatedly.com/2009/06/02/room-with-a-grue/#comment-4784</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike "Scout" Gust</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 17 Jun 2010 04:30:13 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tap-repeatedly.com/?p=3075#comment-4784</guid>
		<description>David Byrne on how architecture shapes music. 

A &lt;a href=&quot;http://www.ted.com/talks/david_byrne_how_architecture_helped_music_evolve.html?utm_source=newsletter_weekly_2010-06-15&amp;utm_campaign=newsletter_weekly&amp;utm_medium=email&quot; rel=&quot;nofollow&quot;&gt;TED lecture&lt;/a&gt; that is tangentially related to this subject. </description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>David Byrne on how architecture shapes music. </p>
<p>A <a href="http://www.ted.com/talks/david_byrne_how_architecture_helped_music_evolve.html?utm_source=newsletter_weekly_2010-06-15&#038;utm_campaign=newsletter_weekly&#038;utm_medium=email" rel="nofollow">TED lecture</a> that is tangentially related to this subject.</p>
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		<title>By: Architecture and videogames Books and articles &#171; S.Irigoyen</title>
		<link>http://tap-repeatedly.com/2009/06/02/room-with-a-grue/#comment-4504</link>
		<dc:creator>Architecture and videogames Books and articles &#171; S.Irigoyen</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 Jun 2010 22:31:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tap-repeatedly.com/?p=3075#comment-4504</guid>
		<description>[...] -Article about architectural spaces in videogames Link [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] -Article about architectural spaces in videogames Link [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Mike "Scout" Gust</title>
		<link>http://tap-repeatedly.com/2009/06/02/room-with-a-grue/#comment-4144</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike "Scout" Gust</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 31 May 2010 02:38:28 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tap-repeatedly.com/?p=3075#comment-4144</guid>
		<description>Good points and probably a couple more articles in what you are bring to the conversation. 

Not sure if you can dismiss a major art form as &quot;simply architecture&quot; (not sure if you meant to either...) but it does highlight how little architecture is understood outside of the halls of architecture firms. I guess bad architecture is so ubiquitous we tend to see architecture just something to hold stuff. I think there is tremendous psychological power to a well designed space, real or virtual. It&#039;s felt on a very instinctive level. I do think we are looking at separate facets of the same thing.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Good points and probably a couple more articles in what you are bring to the conversation. </p>
<p>Not sure if you can dismiss a major art form as &#8220;simply architecture&#8221; (not sure if you meant to either&#8230;) but it does highlight how little architecture is understood outside of the halls of architecture firms. I guess bad architecture is so ubiquitous we tend to see architecture just something to hold stuff. I think there is tremendous psychological power to a well designed space, real or virtual. It&#8217;s felt on a very instinctive level. I do think we are looking at separate facets of the same thing.</p>
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		<title>By: Lyrad</title>
		<link>http://tap-repeatedly.com/2009/06/02/room-with-a-grue/#comment-4038</link>
		<dc:creator>Lyrad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 May 2010 08:59:03 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tap-repeatedly.com/?p=3075#comment-4038</guid>
		<description>&quot;I’m also not arguing for the triumph of graphics over story. I went to some pains to make that point.&quot;

I am aware, and I guess I wasn&#039;t really trying to counter-argue you more than introduce a new perpsective into the subject.

This important concept is the human player.

I felt that comparing the human interpretation against any aspect of a game, such as graphics, gamespaces, music or mechanics can radically change value and effect. If players overlook gamespaces, game graphics or any detail, there usually is a reason for it. And that reason shouldn&#039;t be dismissed without recognition and understanding.

Ultimately I felt game design stems more from psychology than simply architecture. Because I don&#039;t think we are just trying to build something, but craft something meaningful and experiential. You could build a giant world to walk about, but I&#039;d rather play a smaller world which enables me to fly, swim and dig in it. You could lay out elaborate architectured spaces, but I&#039;m ultimately interested in how I can -break- that structure. The two subjects may seem be seemingly different, but I reckon they are but two confusing sides of the same coin that work in a balance.

So yeah, I probably didn&#039;t write my last post that well and digressed a bit. Hopefully this one clarifies things a bit.

Cheers.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>&#8220;I’m also not arguing for the triumph of graphics over story. I went to some pains to make that point.&#8221;</p>
<p>I am aware, and I guess I wasn&#8217;t really trying to counter-argue you more than introduce a new perpsective into the subject.</p>
<p>This important concept is the human player.</p>
<p>I felt that comparing the human interpretation against any aspect of a game, such as graphics, gamespaces, music or mechanics can radically change value and effect. If players overlook gamespaces, game graphics or any detail, there usually is a reason for it. And that reason shouldn&#8217;t be dismissed without recognition and understanding.</p>
<p>Ultimately I felt game design stems more from psychology than simply architecture. Because I don&#8217;t think we are just trying to build something, but craft something meaningful and experiential. You could build a giant world to walk about, but I&#8217;d rather play a smaller world which enables me to fly, swim and dig in it. You could lay out elaborate architectured spaces, but I&#8217;m ultimately interested in how I can -break- that structure. The two subjects may seem be seemingly different, but I reckon they are but two confusing sides of the same coin that work in a balance.</p>
<p>So yeah, I probably didn&#8217;t write my last post that well and digressed a bit. Hopefully this one clarifies things a bit.</p>
<p>Cheers.</p>
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		<title>By: Mike "Scout" Gust</title>
		<link>http://tap-repeatedly.com/2009/06/02/room-with-a-grue/#comment-4029</link>
		<dc:creator>Mike "Scout" Gust</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 20 May 2010 02:11:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tap-repeatedly.com/?p=3075#comment-4029</guid>
		<description>Hi Lyrad,

Thanks for you comments.

I agree with everything you said though I&#039;m not convinced immersion and interactivity are exchangeable nouns for the same activity. I&#039;m also not arguing for the triumph of graphics over story. I went to some pains to make that point. The article is exploring the little discussed phenomena of the experience of space during game play and secondarily the natural evolution from text to 3D.   

I agree that any game can engage a gamer in the way you describe. I&#039;ve had that special buzz with all kinds of games. Yes, text will do just fine.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Hi Lyrad,</p>
<p>Thanks for you comments.</p>
<p>I agree with everything you said though I&#8217;m not convinced immersion and interactivity are exchangeable nouns for the same activity. I&#8217;m also not arguing for the triumph of graphics over story. I went to some pains to make that point. The article is exploring the little discussed phenomena of the experience of space during game play and secondarily the natural evolution from text to 3D.   </p>
<p>I agree that any game can engage a gamer in the way you describe. I&#8217;ve had that special buzz with all kinds of games. Yes, text will do just fine.</p>
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		<title>By: Lyrad</title>
		<link>http://tap-repeatedly.com/2009/06/02/room-with-a-grue/#comment-4021</link>
		<dc:creator>Lyrad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 19 May 2010 15:14:33 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tap-repeatedly.com/?p=3075#comment-4021</guid>
		<description>Whilst I thought the essay was well structured and presented, to me there&#039;s still an area that I valued not covered deeply enough, particularly relating to the area of conceptual understanding.

I still firmly believe that graphics are receiving way too much attention than they are worth. The true worth of graphics is simply to support a concept, because as intelligent humans, we are conceptual creatures. It doesn&#039;t take very long to &#039;get an idea&#039;, especially if it&#039;s something visual. Once a graphical image is understood, the additional detail simply becomes exponentially irrelevant, and we -will- ignore it. This is why many gamers are happy putting with 2D avatars and crappy environments in the hopes that there is something else to look forward to.

If I see lots of clouds, leaves, trees, grass, water, lush hues and colour, I would go &quot;oo, pretty&quot;... for 5 minutes, and the only useful message I would get out of it would be &quot;forest&quot;. This is why I think a crew of 100 3D artists and 2 storywriters is a tragedy. The amount of effort spent making one forest could easily be spent on making something more meaningful and gratifying, like drama, purpose, style, mystery or a mushroom bigger than any man&#039;s imagination.

Majority of this writing is based on the assumption that immersion is the key to all gaming experiences. Which I find sad, because I can think of many other games that I have enjoyed that didn&#039;t care about immersion at all. I like immersion, but I think it is a confused term that isn&#039;t always a good thing. 

Immersion can mean driving realism into a situation until the rest of your senses dull and you are utterly convinced that you are in the specific situation. Lots of games make use of repetition to an insane degree to the point that you no longer enjoy the experience, .. but you are immersed in it. You are stressed and pissed off, and feeling all the emotions as you would in a situation where you were unhappy.

Engagement on the other hand means you are always mentally active, wondering &quot;What is this?&quot; &quot;Why is that there?&quot; &quot;That&#039;s strange.&quot; &quot;Omg, how did that happen?&quot; &quot;I wonder what happens if I do this..&quot; &quot;Ahh, I get it.&quot; &quot;HOLY SHIT, THIS COMPLETELY CHANGES EVERYTHING!&quot; these are the thoughts that truly represent interaction. These are the kinds of situations where people are truly thinking, participating and investing. These kind of thoughts are derived from situations - Situations that don&#039;t even need high level detail of graphics to pull off, just a creative mind and maybe some kind of mechanical understanding. Text will do.

So yeah, just thought I&#039;d add the missing voice to the concept of graphics and the reason why gamers devalue it so much... no matter what Henry Jenkins says.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Whilst I thought the essay was well structured and presented, to me there&#8217;s still an area that I valued not covered deeply enough, particularly relating to the area of conceptual understanding.</p>
<p>I still firmly believe that graphics are receiving way too much attention than they are worth. The true worth of graphics is simply to support a concept, because as intelligent humans, we are conceptual creatures. It doesn&#8217;t take very long to &#8216;get an idea&#8217;, especially if it&#8217;s something visual. Once a graphical image is understood, the additional detail simply becomes exponentially irrelevant, and we -will- ignore it. This is why many gamers are happy putting with 2D avatars and crappy environments in the hopes that there is something else to look forward to.</p>
<p>If I see lots of clouds, leaves, trees, grass, water, lush hues and colour, I would go &#8220;oo, pretty&#8221;&#8230; for 5 minutes, and the only useful message I would get out of it would be &#8220;forest&#8221;. This is why I think a crew of 100 3D artists and 2 storywriters is a tragedy. The amount of effort spent making one forest could easily be spent on making something more meaningful and gratifying, like drama, purpose, style, mystery or a mushroom bigger than any man&#8217;s imagination.</p>
<p>Majority of this writing is based on the assumption that immersion is the key to all gaming experiences. Which I find sad, because I can think of many other games that I have enjoyed that didn&#8217;t care about immersion at all. I like immersion, but I think it is a confused term that isn&#8217;t always a good thing. </p>
<p>Immersion can mean driving realism into a situation until the rest of your senses dull and you are utterly convinced that you are in the specific situation. Lots of games make use of repetition to an insane degree to the point that you no longer enjoy the experience, .. but you are immersed in it. You are stressed and pissed off, and feeling all the emotions as you would in a situation where you were unhappy.</p>
<p>Engagement on the other hand means you are always mentally active, wondering &#8220;What is this?&#8221; &#8220;Why is that there?&#8221; &#8220;That&#8217;s strange.&#8221; &#8220;Omg, how did that happen?&#8221; &#8220;I wonder what happens if I do this..&#8221; &#8220;Ahh, I get it.&#8221; &#8220;HOLY SHIT, THIS COMPLETELY CHANGES EVERYTHING!&#8221; these are the thoughts that truly represent interaction. These are the kinds of situations where people are truly thinking, participating and investing. These kind of thoughts are derived from situations &#8211; Situations that don&#8217;t even need high level detail of graphics to pull off, just a creative mind and maybe some kind of mechanical understanding. Text will do.</p>
<p>So yeah, just thought I&#8217;d add the missing voice to the concept of graphics and the reason why gamers devalue it so much&#8230; no matter what Henry Jenkins says.</p>
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		<title>By: GregP</title>
		<link>http://tap-repeatedly.com/2009/06/02/room-with-a-grue/#comment-1970</link>
		<dc:creator>GregP</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 15 Jun 2009 14:41:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://tap-repeatedly.com/?p=3075#comment-1970</guid>
		<description>Update on the book: finished it over the weekend, and I cannot emphasize enough how unworthy this book was of my reading time.  :)  Completely and totally academic and did not add a single idea or element to my understanding of &#039;video game spaces.&#039;  This seems suited to one who has never played a video game of any kind and wants to know how they can relate to architecture, literature, and cinema.

Oh well ...</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Update on the book: finished it over the weekend, and I cannot emphasize enough how unworthy this book was of my reading time.  <img src='http://tap-repeatedly.com/wp-includes/images/smilies/icon_smile.gif' alt=':)' class='wp-smiley' />   Completely and totally academic and did not add a single idea or element to my understanding of &#8216;video game spaces.&#8217;  This seems suited to one who has never played a video game of any kind and wants to know how they can relate to architecture, literature, and cinema.</p>
<p>Oh well &#8230;</p>
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